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TTTE ATLANTA GEORGIAN ANT) NEWS.
AFTER 15 1-2 HOURS ON STAND, CONLEY ENDS HIS TESTIMONY
Grinning After Ordeal, He Lights Cigarette and Grabs a Newspaper
DEFENSE GIVES UP FUTILE
EFF
Continued from Page 2.
about seeing this negro Monday after
the crime.
Several spectators were put out of
the courtroom for laughing at Mr.
Rosser's admission of the error.
Rosser—I will say it is the first
time that you have been right. Your
honor, we object. It is Immaterial
what time this witness made known
the fact unless they go further and
show she was delayed through the in
fluence of Frank.
The objection was overruled.
Lawyers Clash.
Dorsey—Your honor. I have al- 1
ready shown that Leo Frank knew
on Monday, April 28, that she saw
this negro there, and that it was
May 7 before the State got into pos
session of this fact.
Rosser—I say that no such evi
dence has been introduced.
Dorsey—Call for the record of Har
ry Scott's evidence.
Rosser I say he has not intro
duced this evidence, and he saws he
has. If your hoflor can not romem-
b r some of the things that happen
ht re we are perfectly helpless.
Stenographer Parry was called. He
said he was taking the testimony for
Mr. Arnold and he wanted Mr. Ar
nold’s consent before-reading it.
Q When did you report it to any
one else?
Rosser objected.
Dorsey—I want to show who it was
who first reported to detectives of
the State of Georgia.
The objection was overruled.
Q. When did you report it?—A.
May 2 7.
Rosser took the witness on cross-
examination.
Q. You never declined to tell any
body?—A. No.
Q. 1 want to refresh your memory.
Didn’t you tell Wade Campbell you
saw the negro when you went up?—
A. No.
Q Didn’t you tell Wade Campbell
that when you came down you heard
voice?—A. No; that was when I went
)>P.
Tjie witness was excused.
Sheriff C. W. Mangum was then
called to the stand. Dorsey questioned
him.
Q Were you at the Jail when dim
Conley was brought there?—A. Yes.
Q. Did you have any conversation
with Frank about seeing Conley?
Rosser—I object.
Dorsey—We want To show that this
white man wouldn’t see this ignorant
negro, his accuser. Can I ask the
question ?
Judge Roan—Go ahead.
Frank Didn’t Want to See Police.
A. Chief Beavers, Chief Lanford.
Harry Scott, Detective Black and Jim
Conley came down and wanted to see
Frank, j I asked Frank if he wanted
to see Them, He said no; that his
lawyer was not there and he had no
body to defend him.
Rosser took the witness on cross-
examination.
Q. Mr. Frank knew who was there,
didn’t he?—A. Yes.
Sheriff Mangum was excused, and
Solicitor Dorsey called for Mrs. W. J.
Coleman and George Epps. Neither
answered.
Dorsey—We have got two proposi
tions, and there will be objections to
them. They are Dalton and Epps.
When we finish with them we only
have one more witness—Dr. Harris.
We can’t get him until 2 o’clock, and
we would like to get that argument
over.
Judge Roan sent the Jury from the
room and admonished the attorneys
to give only the authorities and not
to argue the points.
Dorsey—First, we don’t want any
evidence taken out that has already
gone in. Second, we want to substan
tiate what Jim Conley said. Third,
we want to bring out what Mary
Phngan told George Epps on her way
to the factory that Saturday, about
Frank making eyes at her, and that
she was afraid of him.
Attorney Arnold bega*n his argu
ment of objection by reading author
ities. He declared he would include
all three propositions ?n one argu
ment.
DefeYito Compiles Authorities.
During Mr. Arnold’s argument, Mr.
Rosser climbed up in the witness
chair !n which Jim Conley sat during
the thirteen hours Mr. Rosser was
firing questions at him.
Arnold—Do we have to move to
rule it out at the time it is presented?
My friend, Mr. Leonard Haas, has
compiled the authorities, and for this
work he Is one of the most reliable
men I know of.
Arnold then asked the court’s per
mission to remain seated while ad
dressing ?t, as he was feeling hot and
faint. He was allowed to do so. .Judge
Roan spoke to Solicitor Dorsey and
his associates
“What do you say, gentlemen?”
Dorsey It looks this way: If this
evidence goes In on Conley’s testimo
ny unsubstantiated, I can see how It
might appear to the advantage of
the defense. They can go out Ash
ing and If they catch something, they
don’t want to throw it back. They
drew out the relation and association
of Conley and Frank. Now they can’t
diminish it; they slept over’ their
rights.
Mr Arnold, interrupting Mr Dor
sey, read a few more authorities.
"Not Character Evidence,” Says Dor
sey.
Judge Roan—Dorsey, how can
you differentiate this evidence from
< haracter evidence? The defense must
bring bis character in.
Dorsey—No, it is not character evi
dence. 1 know I can't bring Ills char
acter in. If I convict him, of course,
I want to hold hiyv I am not afraid
of the higher court reversing your
honor.
Roan interrupted—No, I am not
either. 1 oon’t care anything about
that.
Roan then declared court adjourned
until 2 o’clock, without any ruling on
I he questions at bar having been
made.
Argument is Resumed.
Court reconvened at 2 o’clock and
with the jury still out, Solicitor Dor
sey continued his argument on the
admissablllty of the evidence that was
stopped by adjournment at the noon
recess.
The Solicitor read first a Supreme
Court decision in which the defense
waived its right to object by not s>
doing when the evidence was given.
He cited a number of Georgia State
cases. He declare that proof of an
other »‘rime, if necessarily an inde
pendent crime, was admissable pro
vided it was intended to illustrate the
state of the defendant’s mind at the
time this crime was committed, and
the fact that it was a crime did no;
make It Inadmissible. therefore as ar
original proposition he declared that
it was admissable,
"Shall we go on with the other ob
jection." the Solicitor then asked
Judge Roan.
"tts,” answered Judge Roan.
Dorsey Cites Example.
Dorsey: "Wo object to any evi
dence that is already in being ruled
out because we expect to introduce
other evidence to substantiate ; t.
Now about the evidence of George
Epps. Here is a case. (Dorsey here
referred to an authority) in which a
man was living with a woman as his
wife. She left him and as heard to
sav she was afraid. This oman was
later murdered and this man was
•*n rrinI for the crime. The
man who heard the remark she made
..*•*..it . ring afraid was permitted to
testify Now we want to show that
when little Mary Phngan was on her
way to the factory where she met her
death, she expressed a fear of this
defendant. It is a circumstance that
points to this man's guilt."
Attorney Hooper here took up the
argument.
"The court desires that we oe
hrlef," he said, "and I promise to be
brief I will confine myself to the
laws of Georgia, for that. I under
stand, is what controls this court
and not decisions from Missouri or
California.
"The Supreme Court of Georgia has
held several times that it would not
r verse a lower court on a decision
unless the objection was made at the
the evidence was submitted.
Dr H. F. Harris, secretary of the
State Board of Health, who testified
th.it Mary Phagan died within half
an hour after eating cabbage, was re
called by the State.
Defense Witness Excused.
At this moment. Attorney Rosser
interrupted to state that one of the
defense's witnesses wished to he ex
cused on account of the death of a
relative. This was VV. T. Holds,
whose relative, J. L. Adair, of Dallas,
On was killed by falling off a street
car’on Marietta street. The witness
was excused and promised to be back
In court by Friday morning
Dorsey then took up the examina
tion of Dr. Harris.
Q What branch in medicine is
yours?' What special branch?—A.
Diagnosis and chemistry.
Q. Why did you sav Man’ Phagan
came to her death from strangula-
tlon?—A An examination showed that
cause to have been thA only probable
one for depth.
Blow Inflicted During Life.
Q. Was that blow on the head given
before death?—-A. It had every evi
dence of having been inflicted during
life.
Q. Was there any evidence on the
windpipe or larynx of strangulation?
—A. No. That is, very little.
q. Are there usually traces in cases
of this kind?—A No.
Q. Did you see the windpipe?—A.
Yes.
Q. Did you see the lungs?—A. Yes.
Q Did you notice anything about
them?—A. No. They would not have
shown anything on account of the em
balming fluid.
Dorsey turned to Mr. Amola:
"Give nv* that baseball bat."
The stick found near where the ne
gro had been sitting on the first floor
of the factory was given the Solicitor.
y. Could this have produced that
cut on the hack of the head?—A. »n
my opinion it could not have. The cut
was too sharp.
Cabbage Question Again Arise*.
y. Now coming to the stomach?
A. I might preface my remarks by
saying that some ten or fifteen years
ago someone suggested to me that the
idea of the Indigestibility of cabbage
was because it usually was cooked
with meats. I conducted some ex
periments. I discovered with some
healthy stomachs with bread and
cabbage was practically the same as
with bread and water."
'1 object," said Attorney Rosser,
"for him to state the results of his
efforts as scientific facts.”
"I was Just explaining," Dr. Har
is interrupted
"Now, Dr. Hands, let me talk Just
a minute.’’ Rosser interrupted.
Judge Roan said; "I rule that you
can testify, If you are alone in the
scientific world on that subject.”
Harris said: ‘I can And no data
on that subject and I made the in
vestigation myself. 1 found that most
Ideas about digesting cabbage were
erroneous when taken with bread
alone. Now, I have some ex
its ”
Rosser Has Real Stomach.
Rosser interrupted again: "I ob
ject to these experiments of his. They
are not admissible," the attorney de
clared "If I ate that cabbage, I would
have it in my stomach to-morrow
morning, and I have a stomach that
will digest leather and nails and al
most anything else.”
Judge Roan ruled: "He can state
that he gave cabbage to whom he
thought was a normal man with cer
tain results. Let him state only the
science of the thing. That alone is
admissible.’’
Tells of Remarkable Test.
Judge Roan then told the witness
to go ahead.
Attorney Arnold was on his feet
immediately “Your honor, If he
means that he is going to show- ex
periments on the same sort of stom
ach as Mary Phagan’s," Arnold
shouted, "that is different, but you
know that it is not fair to compare
the stomachs of grown men with lit
tle girls. There are also differences
in the manner of cooking.”
Dr. Harris said: "I have made the
conditions as near parallel as possi
ble. I had Mary Phagan’s mother
cook the cabbage and one of the per
sons I experimented on was a girl
about her agq. I know her stomach
was normal.”
"Arnold said: "There are no two
stomachs in the world alike.”
Harris continued:- "Some years ago
I made experiments on twenty or
thirty persons."
Rosser said: "I object to what he
did twenty or thirty years ago. and
I object to his argumentative idea.”
Judge Roan said: "The witness
might not be argumentative.”
Rosser’s Opinion of Scientist.
Rosser said: "l insist that these
examinations might be vitally differ
ent. How can he tell the exact na
ture of these things? How can he
experiment except upon the same sub.
I have
doctors
Harris.’
Ject and except upon the same stom
ach ?”
Judge Roan said: "But he is a
scientist."
Rosser said: "Oh, bosh!
always thought that these
were guessing.”
Roan said: "Proceed, Dr.
Dr. Harris continued:
"Well, the digestion takes from 38
to 70 minutes In the cabbage found
In Mary Phagan’s stomach. I found
that even the most minute particles
had not gone through the process of
digestion. In fact, it was plainly no
ticeable to the naked eye that there
was practically no digestion. Even
In an hour’s time there is digestion
and it is well advanced. As a matter
of greater importance ”
Rosser said: "I object to ‘a matter
of greater importance.’ ”
Rosser overruled the objection.
Dr. Harris launched Into a tech
nical discussion as to the amount of
cabbage in the stomach and intes
tines.
Rosser said: "I object to that, he
is making an argument. It is noth
ing more nor less than a stump
speech."
Judge Roan said: "He is giving his
opinion. Continue, Dr. Harris.”
Certain Death Came Soon.
Harris said: "I want to stare that
the amount of secretive Juice in this
stomach was considerably less than
would have collected in an hour. The
hydrochloride acid had not been in
long enough to become free. The
amount of confined hydrochloric was
32 degrees. In a normal stomach, the
amount would have been 55 or 60 de
grees. It was Just about the amount
one would have supposed to have col
lected In half an hour or 35 to 40
minutes. I can say with absolute
certainty that she was unconscious
within 30 or 40 minutes after she ate
the cabbage.”
Dorsey then questioned the witness.
Q Do you know- w’hether or not the
failure to digest this cabbage was due
to indigestion?—A. No sir, that stom
ach was normal. The gastric juics
were there.
Q. What about the glands?—A. The
glands were the principal part of the
stomach—they were all there.
Q. Was the digestion progressing
favorably?—A. Yes. it was normal and
stopped by whatever happened.
Bread in Like State.
Q. Was the examination micros
scopic?—A. Yes. It was made with
the best instrument possible to pro
cure.
Q. How about the stage of digestlmi
of the bread? Did it show to the.
same extefit?—A. Exactly the same.
Q. Suppose that large piece of cab
bage had have been ohew’ed up tint ?
Would it have h*d any effect on the
digestive process’. —A. Not the slight
est.
Arnold took the witness on the
cross-examination.
Q. When did you make this ex
amination?—A. May 5.
Q. Did Dorsey request you not to
make result of your examination
public?—A. Yes.
Kept Promise of Secrecy.
Q. Did you keep your promise in
this respect?—A. Yes.
Q. Did he ask you as Solicitor Gen
eral or personally?—A. Ht: did not
state. I did it because I liked him
personally.
Q. What part of the body did he
ask you to examine?—A. None. He
Just asked me to make an examina
tion and find out all I could.
Q. How did you know the girl died
hv strangulation?—It was plainly
discernible.
Q. Externally?—A. Yes. The marks
were on the throat.
Q. Gould not the same marks be
made if the rope w’as placed around
the neck of a dying person?—A. Yes,
the heart were still beating.
Q. How long does it take for a
person to die by strangulation?—A.
There is no special time.
Tolls of Strangu’ation Effects.
Q. Isn’t it true that the time re
quired for a person to strangle is
from 20 to 30 minutes?—A. There are
different times, all according to the
circumstances.
Q. Isn’t drowning strangulation?—
A. One form.
O. Isn't the effect just the same?—
A. There are different effects on the
body.
Q. Rut strangulation is simply cut
ting off oxygen from the lungs?—A.
Yes. but there are different fornix in
strangulation by choking; there are
poisons which gain control. In
drowning entirely different elements
enter which produce an entirely dif
ferent state of the body.
Q. What is the average time it tak*>g
a person to die froui strangulation?—
A. I don’t know.
Q. Haven’t statistics been compiled?
—A. Well, it is practically impossible
to tell when life leaves the body. I
saw a man once who was pulled out
of the water with his heart still beat
ing, but he was not breathing and we
failed to revive him.
Q. He was alive, wasn’t he?—A. I
don’t know’.
Made Tests for Poisons.
Q. You say you were going to ex
amine for poison—what kind of poi
son?—A. Alkaloids.
Q. That’s vegetable poison? Why
didn't you examine for poison like
arsenic?—A. The undertaker had told
me he used some of the metal poisons
in embalming the body.
Q. How did you know what he had
M sed?—A. 1 sent for him and he told
me.
Q. Did he give you that valuable
formula he was so secretive abodt
here?—A. Yes. I guess he thought
better of me.
Q. How- far did you continue this
examination?—A. When I failed ‘o
find any alkaloids, I gave it up.
Q. You tested for opium?—A. Yes
Q. Opium has about twenty-three
alkaloids?—A. Yes.
Q. What test did ytou use?—A. The
usual test—the color test.
Q. How much did you find?—A.
None.
Q. How much of the contents of the
stomach did you use in your test for
alkaloids?—A. I made a number of
tests. I can't say just how many.
Q. As much as that half a glass of
water?—A. About half of that.
Q. Were the contents liquid or sol
id?—A. Both.
Q. Did you make a poison test be
fore the others?—A. Simultaneously.
Made Eight Tests.
Q. Into how many parts did you
divide the contents of the stomach?
—A. As many as were necessary—I
don’t remember.
Q. Did you say you had six or eight
tests going at the same time as to
the digestibility of the food? Why
did you make eight?—A. Because that
many were necessary.
Q. Will you explain those tests?
Dr. Harris went into an elaborate
technical explanation of the various
stage? of the tests. Mr. Arnold ap- |
peared to be unable to understand a
number of the words used. Turnine: |
to the stenographer he said: "This is j
very important—I just want to know
f von are getting It. I don’t quite
understand it.” The s tenographer re-
nlled that he had taken the testimony
down. <
Q. In all this testing you made you
were attempting to ascertain the
amount of hydrochloric acid in the
stomach 9 —A. Yes.
Q. How much was that?—A Elev
en-one hundredths of fifteen drops.
Q. That would amount to about a
drop and a half, wouldn’t it?—4. Yes
Q. How much free hvdrochloric
acid did you find?—A. None.
Q. What is gastric juice?—A. It is
a Juice secreted in th« stomach.
Function of Pepsin.
Q. Ts hydrochloric acid to be found
in gastric juice?—A. Yes, one of its
m/*st important ingredients.
Q. Wbnt is the most important in
gredient?—A. Pepsin.
Q. What is the effect of hvdrochlo- I
ric acid on pepsin?—A. It brings it i
out.
Q. What amount of hydrochloric j
acid did yon find *n the stomach?—A.
Thirtv-two degrees.
“No, I wouldn’t care
"He’s got a right to
will show you.
Arnold said:
for that."
Dorsey said:
n.” .
Roan ruled with the Solicitor, but
on the insistence of Mr. Arnold, Har
ris did not go into the explanation.
Q. What juice flows through ‘the
mouth?—A. Saliva.
Q. That is a great aid to digestion,
isn’t it?—A. Well, that’s a question as
to just how much it really counts.
Q. Doctors disagree about that ltke
they do about everything else?—A.
Well a numbor of analyses have be n
made and some doctors hold to one
theory and some to others.
At this point Dr. Harris asked jf
the examination could stop. The at
torneys agreed that it might stop for
the afternoon, and Detective Starnes
was called to tht stand. Dorsey took
the witness.
Q. At the request of Dr. Harris,
did you get a cabbage and take it to
Mrs. Coleman and ask her to cook it
like the one she cooked on the day
Mary Phagan was killed?—A. Yes.
Mrs. Coleman was called to th?
stand and substantiated Starnes’
statement, and declared that she
cooked the cabbage.
C. O. Dalton was then called to the
stand but upon the request of jury
men, court was adjourned for the
day to reconvene at 9 o’clock Thurs
day morning. Dr. Harris probably
will be called to the stand' again
Thursday.
Mothers' Testimony
Binds Over Man Who
Cruelly Beat Son
Girl Is Bun Down by
Anto on Whitehall
A small girl, who refused to give
her name, was knocked down and
badly bruised by an automobile driven
by Lewis Carhart, on Whitehall street,
in front of Rich Brothers’ store about
noon Wednesday. The child was taken
into Cone’s store and her bruises
bandaged, ana then put in a cab and
taken home.
Eyewitnesses to the accident say it
was unavoidable The car was going
slowly and the girl ran in front of it
before it could, be stopped. No arrest
was made.
Several mothers appeared in police
court Wednesday to testify that J. S.
Newman, 41 Gasklll street, Tuesday
brutally beat his 11-year-old boy. Joe
Newman, with a board.
The mothers declared they would
never think of whipping a child as
severely as Newman did.
Newman insisted that the boy de
served a good thrashing, and quoted
"Hpare the rod and spoil the child.”
Judge Preston, declaring it one of
the worst case that had come to his
notice, bound the father over to the
State courts in bond of $300.
Detroit Wins Cut
In Street Car Fare
Kills Man Who Held
Her Captive in Woods
MEMPHIS, TENN., Aug. 6.—Mabel
Farmer, 16, shot and killed Henry
Blanz to-day when ho threatened her
life because she would not elope with
him.
The girl told the police after the
shooting that Blanz forced her to
leave her home and remain with him
for twelve hours in the woods.
DETROIT. MICH., Aug. 6.—A com
promise in the city's fight for 3-cent
street car fares was effected to-day
when the Detroit United Railway
agreed to sell seven tickets for 25
cents, after an automobile firm of
fered the city the use of 1,000 auto
mobiles in case the company refused
to operate its cars.
A strike of employees, held off by
a promise of arbitration, is threaten
ed unless the company’s arbitrator
agrees with the union’s representa
tive upon a third arbitrator within
24 hours.
Woman Injured in
Chicago Race Riot
CHICAGO, Aug. 6.—Mrs. Mary A.
Barrett was in a serious condition to.
day as the result of a riot between
whites and negroes on a street car.
The trouble was caused by a re
mark of a negro directed at one of
the white passengers.
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Q. What is the normal amount in a
normal man’s stomach?—A. Fifty-six
degrees.
Q. What was the relative amount of
pepsin in her stomach as compared
to the amount of hydrochloric acid?
—A. We have no test for determining
the exact amount of pepsin.
Q. What is the third most impor
tant ingredient in the gastric juice?
—A. There is none of importance.
Q. Put there is water?—A Oh, yes,
thero is water. We might sav that
gastric juice is composed of hydro
chloric acid, pepsin and water. In
fact, a solution of those three ingre-
d'ents could be made and taken and
digest the food as well as the gastric
juice found in the stomach.
Q. That is the reason people some
times take pepsin?—A. Yes.
Nothing Else in Stomach.
Q These experiments were made an
live subjects? How about exneri-
ments on corpses?—A. That would be
very clumsy.
Q. Whv?—A\ The difficulty in get
ting bodies with the proper food mix
tures in them.
Q. Did you examine the small intes
tine in this case?—A. Yes.
O. What did you find?—A. Practi
cally nothing.
Q. Did you save any of the con
tents of the stomach?—A. No.
Q. All you preserved was this cab
bage in this bottle?—A. Yes.
Q. You didn’t analyse these particu
lar leaves?—A. No. I took these out
just as T started my examination.
Q. Did you find anything besides
bread and cabbage?—A. Absolutely
nothing.
Q. Did you find any of the cabbage
chewed?—A. Yes. a good deal of it.
Q. How did you know it was cab
bage. Tell me its chemical analysis?
—A. I have a book with some 67
analyses of cabbace. Just for a gen
eral idea you mi^ht say 9ft per cent
water 1ft per cent solid.
Cabhaoes I'arv. He Says.
O Do individutl cabbages vary? —
A. I would say s». f:»>m these" analyses.
Give me that book over there and I
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